Amena Brown:
Hey, everybody. Welcome back to this week's episode of HER, with Amena Brown. And you know, we've been a little bit of time with me being here in the living room with you all, just chatting you, and telling y'all my business. But, I am happy to bring guests into the living room, that's what the living room is for. You all, we're here, we're guests together. But, we are bringing a guest, and I am so excited, y'all. We have with us licensed psychologist, professor, poet, author, President Elect of the American Psychological Association, and author of Homecoming: Overcome Fear and Trauma to Reclaim Your Whole Authentic Self, Dr. Thema Bryant is here with us. Dr. Thema, thank you so much.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Oh, thank you. I love the introduction, I can hear the poetic flow.
Amena Brown:
It never goes away, you do other things, but it never leaves you.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Right, that's it. It's in.
Amena Brown:
Dr. Thema, I'm so excited that you are joining us, y'all, this book right here. Let me tell y'all, sometimes a book that can bring healing to you upsets you, and those books also have their place. But sometimes, a book that can bring healing to you, like you start reading it and you already feel like you're breathing a bit easier, and that's what your pages felt like to me. And so, I hope as we talk about this, Dr. Thema, that folks who have not gotten their copy of Homecoming can make sure that they do, because it is a good breath for all of us to take.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Mm-hmm, thank you, I'm so grateful to hear that. And that really was the intention, I think some people have this false idea that telling people off, or dismantling people is what healing looks like. And we have enough dismantling, we have enough of the violation, and the assaults. So, our healing should be an invitation to something deeper, and more honoring of who we are, even as it stretches us, but still holds us.
Amena Brown:
Yeah, mm-hmm, I love that. Now, I want to start with a very important question, it's a very serious question that we need to talk about, which is snacks, Dr. Thema. Snacks, it's very important. It could be a part of our healing journeys, is snacks.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Absolutely.
Amena Brown:
So, when I talked to our HER With Amena community, I always say to them, this podcast is sort of my vision of what my living room has been like, where my girlfriends and I gather together. And sometimes, we had enough money to charcuterie board, and sometimes we just had enough money to have some unfinished hummus that happened to be sitting in the fridge, and my girlfriend brought a bell pepper she had kind of cut a little bit off of, and we just combined all the things together, you know?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Made it work, yeah.
Amena Brown:
So, if you're in this situation with your friends, or your family, whoever you like to gather with, what's your snack that you typically bring to the space?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes. First, I would think individual snacks, so just my regular snack by myself, to myself, are almonds. I am the almond queen.
Amena Brown:
That's a good one.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And hot green tea is my soothing blanket. If I was going somewhere, I'm not going to just bring almonds, so...
Amena Brown:
But when people love you, you could. You could.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yeah, you could, that's true, that's true. And they would appreciate my almond bag.
Amena Brown:
Now, let me ask you a quick question about these almonds, Dr. Thema. Is this roasted, unsalted?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes, no, no, no-
Amena Brown:
Are you... What are the vibes?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
... we're roasted, we're not unsalted over here. We need a flavor to it.
Amena Brown:
Okay, a little flavor? I like it, I like it, okay. And if you were in a situation where you had to bring your snack, but also maybe other people going to share, then what would be the vibes?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes. So, snack-wise, I think when you said hummus, that often resonates. And since I've been living in California, which has been some time, I've gotten into avocado and guacamole, so we could definitely roll with that as well.
Amena Brown:
That's always a good choice, I'm going to admit Dr. Thema, because I feel like this is a safe space, that I really don't get along with avocados, and I have a few friends that they try to love me in spite of, they're just... Mm-hmm.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
In spite of, that's all right. I grew up in Baltimore, in Baltimore we didn't eat avocado. So, I'm good with that. It's just, it's a late arrival for me.
Amena Brown:
It's like, if it's in a guacamole for some reason, I can handle it there. But my friends that slice it up, and they just salt and pepper, it's new for me. But now that you're saying this, Dr. Thema, I'm wondering to myself, because I live in Atlanta. So, I'm wondering to myself if a part of that is location-
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yeah, you just didn't grow up with it.
Amena Brown:
... and that the avocados where you live might taste better-
Dr. Thema Bryant:
True, that is true.
Amena Brown:
... than what we're getting down here, so...
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And really, it really comes down to the seasoning too, what you shake on there.
Amena Brown:
Mm-hmm. Come on, what you shake on there. Maybe that's what avocado needs, maybe when I added it it wasn't seasoned right.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Shake something, yeah, yeah, it-
Amena Brown:
I'm so glad we had this talk.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
... needed a little something.
Amena Brown:
So, Dr. Thema, in addition to your work as a psychologist, you are also a poet. I find that so wonderful and fascinating, and maybe it's also personal for me that I'm a poet too. But, what role has poetry played in your work, and in your life? How do you see that foundation sort of playing a role, even in what you're doing today?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
It's so important, because a lot of times when we're in need of healing, we have been silenced. And so, our stories haven't been told, they've been diluted, we've had to read the script of what somebody else wanted us to say. So, a part of our healing is getting my words back, right?
Amena Brown:
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And reclaiming my voice. And so, I have used poetry to heal both personally, and with clients. With clients, I can use it individually, with people receiving kind of homework assignments to write on a theme that came up in session, or writing in-session. And I've also done poetry therapy groups, where the entire therapeutic process is centered around reading poetry, reflecting on poetry, writing our own, and sharing our own. And I can remember once at a poetry coffee house in Boston where I used to live, after I shared a piece, and it was the first time someone said to me, "I feel like I was just in therapy." And so I think it's a wonderful vehicle to bring healing beyond the walls of the private practice office.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And, I will even say a lot of times in poetry spaces, that healing voice is needed because sometimes in open mike, it can just be like a series of horrible experiences with no breath, and no life. And I'm glad people are getting it out, but for those who are receiving it, it can be some nights, depending on just who signs up, it can be a dry space. And so, that combination of speaking truth, but truth with breath.
Amena Brown:
Mm-hmm. Oh, that breath is so important, and I recall this about the open mike. You could have some nights where that almost felt like this church, or sort of spiritual space, right?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yeah.
Amena Brown:
I mean, you could have some nights where you were kind of like, "Okay, I don't know what I need to do when I leave here, but I've got to do something else."
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Because something else is like, I just sat through seven terrible things to get to that one good one.
Amena Brown:
Like, "It's only coffee served here. What do I do with myself?"
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Right, right. Come on, come on.
Amena Brown:
I want to talk about the journey that led to you writing your book, and I know that we have many listeners that have dreams in their own hearts of wanting to write a book, and having experienced book writing on different levels for those of us who are authors too, there's all this journey that leads to what people actually hold in their hands. Sometimes the title comes first, sometimes the theme of maybe what you want to write. What was the journey like that led you to writing this book, and did you always feel in your heart that writing books was something you wanted to do?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes. I will credit the seed with my mom, she used to get my brother and I journals very early, like in elementary school, and would encourage us to write poetry, to write our thoughts, to write solutions to world problems. So, I'd been writing early, and she is a writer. And a large part of my professional career as a professor and a researcher has been academic writing, and academic writing is like the opposite of poetry. For me, it feels very restricted, and very narrow. And so, because I have really a heart for community, I have always had the desire to be able to create resources where people can get the information, and it's not just full of jargon. A lot of my prior books are academic books that are used to train future psychologists.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
So because they're textbooks, they're very expensive. So, I would never even tell members of the community about them, because I'm not going to have them pay $65. So, to be able to write something that most people can access for $20 is in alignment with my values. And the other piece that happened in terms of the pathway here is, I started the Homecoming Podcast about three years ago, and I started the podcast in the aftermath. So, I post mental health quotes on social media, and people always write asking for more information. Because you know, a tweet can only be a certain number of characters. So, to deal with people having questions I said, "Okay, let me do the podcast." The podcast, it was like 30 minute episodes. And then people would write me after the episode with more questions.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
So it's like, I could keep trying to email people back one at a time, or I could put all this in a resource, and people could have it in their hands. And also, I was blessed that the publisher approved the audiobook as well, for people who preferred to listen. And so, it really came from wanting to share knowledge, that it should not just be for the elite, or for the wealthy. But, that knowledge is power, knowledge is healing. And so, that's why I wrote it.
Amena Brown:
Mm-hmm (affirmative), I love that. And I'm just always curious to hear about the journey to book-writing, and even for yourself as a writer you've had these different genres of experience, where you've written poetry, you've written academic work, and now writing something that is for the people, so to speak, you know?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes, yes, absolutely.
Amena Brown:
You're hoping that anyone can access that, I love that. There's so much to say that I loved about your book. First of all, I personally love that there are homework sections in this book, because-
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Excellent.
Amena Brown:
... I didn't enjoy homework in school. But let me tell you, when I'm in a healing space that kind of question-asking, and having different activities I can try to sort of process things, that is so helpful for me. So, when I saw that I was like, "Oh, I love that," you know? That gives you something... Because sometimes you can read something, and you're taking it in. But especially some of what is in your book that you're really walking people through with some hard things that people may have experienced in life, so you can even read the chapter, and then at the end of the chapter feel like, "Okay, well, I don't know what to do with myself, or with these feelings or thoughts." So, talk to us more about what the process was of you deciding this book shouldn't just have sort of traditional chapters, it should also have these places for application.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes, absolutely. I personally, and then I have also witnessed and heard many people who will say like, a podcast was moving, a sermon was moving, a book was moving, and nothing has changed. It was like an emotional high that did not translate in any way to our real lives or behaviors, and that also shows up in therapy. There are some times I will have clients who, and I think I even say this in the book, who hide behind the word confused. They'll keep saying, "I don't know, I don't know, I'm confused," which is immobilizing. "I never have to take action as long as I say I don't know." So, people can spend years in therapy talking about thinking about change. And at some point, we have to either shift, or be willing to tell yourself the truth that I have decided to stay where I am.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And I just had a client this past week who was kind of doing that, talking in circles. The week before had said they want to change something, this week it was back to the normal. So I said, "So your truth is, you have decided to stay?" So, we just have to get to that. Because no shift is also a choosing, and it's a decision. So, let's own our lives. I think the importance of agency and empowerment is important, and I'm also aware... I think the significance of the homework is, some people need the steps. I think sometimes people assume that everybody has access to the same information, or knows what to do. But like you said, you could come to that and say, "Well, that's interesting. But what do I do with that?" So, the practical part is important.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
That's why kind of my two phrases I often strive for within my work is inspiration and information. So yes, I want people to feel capable, feel inspired to do it, but then now, what's something specific to do?
Amena Brown:
Yeah. Okay, I want to talk about... Y'all, I'm just here with like a thousand things, and I'm like, "I only have a certain amount of time to talk to Dr. Thema," y'all know, you know? We're not here for two weeks where I can be like, "Anyways girl, what about this, what about that?" Okay, but, let me ask you about this. One of the themes that you talked about in the book is the idea of disconnection, and I found that idea in the way you were helping the reader kind of unfold what that means. I found that idea so powerful on a lot of levels, we are here at the time of this recording still currently in a pandemic, while sort of feeling the tensions of decisions that may be made out of our control, or decisions we have to make regarding how we still sort of try to air quotes, "Move forward, even though we are still currently here, right?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yeah.
Amena Brown:
And so, it was really a powerful idea to me, because I think the last two years of living through a pandemic, particularly speaking to those of us here in America, but really globally as well, there's a lot of disconnection that we either discovered because of the pandemic, and how that changed and switched our lives. Or, the pandemic itself, that experience, whether that was our change in work, our change in our family or social life, all these different ways that affected us. So, I wanted to see if you can give a few of the signs, the rest of the signs are in the book. But, I want to see if you can give a few of the signs, how can we recognize that we may be disconnected? Because one of the things you're talking about there in the book is that we could really live our lies disconnected, and not know, or not recognize, really.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Mm-hmm, yeah, absolutely.
Amena Brown:
Can you talk more about that?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yeah, thank you for that, and for putting it in the context of the pandemic. Because I think we still really haven't fully taken in what that means for us emotionally, psychologically, the cost and the impact. And a lot of people are just trying to go through the motions, or business as usual. But it has been a major disconnection, a disconnection from other people, and a disconnection from ourselves. So, one of the signs that you're disconnected is when you're numb. So, when you don't feel anything one way or another, we see all of these deaths by the pandemic, we see all this racial injustice, we see all of these political dynamics. If nothing moves you, then you're checked out. And we have all seen people, and even experienced times in our lives that we were present, but not present.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And so, to be aware like, when did I stop feeling? When did I stop feeling is one of the warning signs. Another warning sign is when you remain in unfulfilling circumstances. So, when I stay on a dead end job, when I stay in a dead relationship, it requires that I check out from myself. There's no other way to do that. And so, and I think I referenced it in the book, the person who was at a job they hated, they complained about it all the time. And when I asked about other options, they literally said, "Well, I only have 10 more years till retirement." It's like, 10, a decade? You're going to do this to yourself for a decade?" And I say that even with my knowledge of poverty, and classism, and all of these things.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
But sometimes, there are options. Sometimes, we are not as stuck as we believe, and that is also being in unfulfilling relationships where people are more about counting the years than counting the joy. "Wow, we did it." And it's like, but what's the quality of those years? What's the quality of that time? And so, I would say if nothing really moves you anymore, or if you know you're in an unfulfilling place, you're probably disconnected, and in need of a homecoming.
Amena Brown:
Yeah, a return. Oh, I love that. I mean, there's a lot of hearing that word, especially in Black community, really across diaspora, right?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes.
Amena Brown:
There's a lot of themes of that idea. I remember going to funerals growing up, that were referred to as homegoing, right?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Mm-hmm, yes.
Amena Brown:
And then there were sort of like homecoming in my Black college experience, and there's also church homecoming, when sort of the preacher from your mamma, or your grandma returns. Would be like, "Y'all, I know y'all been out there, ain't going to church. Come on back this one weekend," you know?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Right. "Come home, come on home."
Amena Brown:
So, just all the levels of that were present for me too.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes, yes, I love you raising that. It's one of those cultural links, when Chris Rock says he can say the same joke, and Black people will hear one joke, and white people will hear a different joke. So it is like all of the cultural meanings of home for us, thinking of community, thinking of identity, thinking of places of belonging, thinking of celebration, thinking about the collective process. As a friend of mine said... Actually, I think it was an interview for a podcast, they said, "Do you think we need a national homecoming?" Yeah, and a part of this process is individual, but a part of it is the collective as well.
Amena Brown:
Yeah, yeah. Oh, I love that. When you were talking about the dead end relationships, and how we can begin to count those by the years, it made me think about that old In Living Color sketch, where it was like the older couple. And they would say, "But we're still together," after they fought, and insulted each other, and all these things. "But we're still together." It's like, "Well, maybe we don't have to be, if that's not what's working. We'll talk about that."
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Right. It's an important question of like, how we measure success. Because sometimes, people are loyal to situations that are not loyal to them, and it can be... If how I count success is endurance, but I am enduring with something that is breaking my spirit, it's not really healthy.
Amena Brown:
Mm-hmm. Oh, that's so good. I'm going to talk a little bit about therapy, especially those who are new to therapy, or considering therapy. I know here in this podcast living room space, we've talked a lot about the power of therapy, and the process of therapy, and how it is good to be able to remove... In some of our communities, we have sort of a sense of shame, if we find ourselves feeling like we need to see a professional, that we are beyond what our friends or our family can do to help us. So as a professor, as well as a psychologist yourself with a practice, what are the thoughts, tips, advice you would give to folks who are either new to therapy, or who are sort of on that teetering edge, considering? They're thinking, "This is something I need," but they feel apprehensions. What thoughts would you give to those thoughts?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yeah, absolutely. I love the question, because it is important for us to know that we are deserving of healing space, we're deserving of spaces where we don't have to be on, where we don't have to perform, where we don't have to be the caretaker, where we can receive. And so, friendship, and romantic relationships, and family are all beautiful and have their place. But, that is not the same thing as working through an issue with a trained professional. And so yes, get auntie's advice, get your sister, friend's advice. But then also, get the strategies for the healing, and the deprogramming, and the shifting of your life. And a couple important things I would say, one is not every therapist is the same. So, the same way you would shop around for a university, or shop around for a church home, you can shop around for a therapist.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
So, just because you go to one session doesn't mean you all are going to hit it off. And if you don't hit it off, to not think, "Oh, I tried therapy, it doesn't work." Because therapists have different styles, and different personalities. So, you just want to check in with yourself to say like, "What was it about it that I didn't like, so that I can know going forward?" And so, to be empowered about that, that you can ask questions, think about the primary issues or challenges you wanted to work on. And then look at their website and see, do they make any reference to those things? Because they may be brilliant in something that's not your thing. Someone is an addiction specialist, and you're coming there because you're tired of being single, they may not have that.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Many people are generalists, but you want to think about what are the things you want to work on, asking them if they've worked with people with those issues. And then if demographics are important to you, then you can look at that as well. Some people prefer younger, some people prefer older. Some people have preferences around gender, or sexuality, or race and ethnicity. And I will say, if they are not your same demographic, to be comfortable and empowered asking them questions about that, to see if it can still work. Because there are times that it can, you would just have to feel that out, if there is a sense of home or safety there for you. And, one of the things that people often go in who have never been in therapy, at the first session they often want to say, "How long is this going to take?"
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And like, you know, "How long before I'm healed and transformed?" And to that I would say, unless you have a therapist that's working with a manual, we can't give you the exact number of weeks. Now sometimes, let's say if you go to a college counseling center, each student is allowed eight sessions and that's it for the school year. So then that's not necessarily eight sessions then you're done, but eight sessions and you're done, that's all they're going to give you. So, there are some approaches that are, like if I run a trauma recovery group that's a set number of weeks. But in general, if I'm working with someone individually, I can't tell you in the beginning how long it's going to be. A part of the reason is because most of us don't come in the first session really revealing everything.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
So, it continues to unpeel, some because you don't trust the person yet, some because of shame, and some it's not in your awareness. Sometimes we're not thinking about it, we didn't realize that we're still carrying that. And then something will happen in-session that will remind you of like, "Oh, that's just like whatever that situation is." But, you want to say like, "What am I gaining from it, do I... How do I feel when I'm there, and how do I feel when I leave?" And what I do say to clients is, some sessions are harder than others. And it is different than friendship, even for therapists have to make a suggestion when I'm doing training for future therapists. Because when I'm talking to a friend, if you're upset about something, we're going to stay on the phone for hours until you're ready to hang up, or we fall asleep.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Or, I'm going to come over to your house, and we're going to be there for hours. So, therapy is generally an hour, which means we're pressing pause. And so for some people, they could feel like, "But wait, I'm not done." It's not going to be done today, right?
Amena Brown:
Right, right.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
It's not going to be all finished today, but we're going to press pause, reflect on what came up in the hour. We'll continue it next time. So, that sometimes is a part people have to adjust to.
Amena Brown:
Mm-hmm. These are such great tips, folks. I hope that y'all are listening to that. I know there are people listening right now who are like, "Hmm, I think it's time, I think I need." So, I'm hoping Dr. Thema was able to give you some things to help the process of going into therapy, especially if it's your first time. Or, it could be your first time in a long time, that it's okay that you feel those fears, or those nerves, and all of that. And all of that is normal and good, and it is possible to find someone that feels like a good fit for you. I love those tips you gave. I want to ask a few Dr. Thema questions, we're just going to get a slight personal moment here. I also gravitated to your book, Dr. Thema, because I love things that have the theme of home.
Amena Brown:
I was a kid that grew up military, I experienced both branches of the military in one childhood, Air Force and Army, so I moved around a lot. And then I grew up to be a person that traveled a lot for work, so there's a lot of... Even in my creative work, that them of sort of how we make home, how we find home, how we return to it, all those themes are always so interesting to me. So, I would love if you can share with us what is one place, or one person who feels like home to you?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes, yeah. The example I want to give for this, I think it's so important because it disrupts these notions of women not getting along, or women being competitors, or petty, or all of these kind of sexist myths. I have a group called The Gathering, and it's a group of powerful women, and we meet monthly. And before the pandemic we met at my house, and since the pandemic we meet on Zoom. But the powerful thing, the enriching thing about this sisterhood circle is, we... The first hour we would eat and just kind of casually catch up. And the second hour, we'd each give a reflection, like about five minutes. And what it allows is that not one person is the pouring one, or not one person has to be the strong one, like everybody recedes.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
And so yes, I'm going to share something. But then, I'm getting something from everybody else in the circle, and it's that whole piece of iron sharpens iron. So, a sisterhood circle is important where we don't have to be on, where I don't feel the weight of, "I am here," carrying it all. But really being peers, and being sisters, and I definitely feel home the first Sundays of every month.
Amena Brown:
Oh, I love that. I love that, I love the sense of regularity, you know?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes.
Amena Brown:
I think there's something really just stabilizing about that, as well as... Especially when I have friends... I mean, my mom is a nurse, I have friends who are nurses, I have friends who work in social work. I feel like particularly when you work in a cares sort of field or industry, you can not have a lot of places, sometimes, where you can go and also be poured into. And I loved that sort of collective, that, there's no one person that has to have the encouraging word to say, or you know? There's no pressure, you can just... Whatever your reflection is. I love that, that leveling of the emotional playing field in a way, it's wonderful.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Right, right, yeah, it's wonderful. I love it.
Amena Brown:
Now, I've got to ask you about food, because it's important to me. What food reminds you of home?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
The food that most reminds me of home is a food I cannot eat often, and that is homemade bread.
Amena Brown:
Oh, yes. So good, so good. Just, even the way it makes your house smell, that's what I was going to say, yeah.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
It's the smell of it, the taste of it.
Amena Brown:
The way it smells, you're automatically like, "Yes, this is it."
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yeah, home, home.
Amena Brown:
Is there a particular kind of homemade bread? Is it sourdough, is it multigrain? What's it doing there? Or, is it all the homemade breads?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
All of it, all of it. You see my face? All of it.
Amena Brown:
I love that. We celebrate bread around here, we love bread. It's delicious. What is one thing that is bringing you joy right now. Dr. Thema?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
I'm going to say my kids. They are such a delight, and two very different personalities. So, it's just beautiful to see people as themselves. We show up to the planet as our own little unique beings, so it's a pleasure watching them, and getting to know their just quirks, and their spirit. And my daughter is a mini-me, very studios and focused. And what I say to people is, my son came to teach me humility. He's a firecracker, and so when I just have my daughter I just would say, "We'll go over here, or not to talk loud," whatever you say she's going to do. And so I was like, "Parenting," right? "Parenting is a piece of cake," right. So then with my son it's like, "Sit down, sit down, sit down, sit down." So I said, it has given me a lot more grace and compassion for myself and for other parents. But yeah, I enjoy them.
Amena Brown:
Oh, I love that. Dr. Thema, the people are listening, the people want to know where they can get this book, so that they can begin their own journeys. The people want to know how they can stay connected to you and your work. Where would you tell the people to go?
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes, absolutely. My website is Drthema.com, D-R-T-H-E-M-A. I would encourage you to get the Homecoming book, to listen to the Homecoming Podcast, which is on all major platforms. We're up to like 140-some episodes, so go catch up. And I am in social media the most on Twitter and Instagram. In March, when the book came out, I joined TikTok, so I have a couple of videos there.
Amena Brown:
Look, come on Dr. Thema.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Yes, come join me, come on.
Amena Brown:
Come on and TikTok for the people, y'all-
Dr. Thema Bryant:
That's it, that's it.
Amena Brown:
... can return to yourselves on TikTok too, mm-hmm.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Come on, for the people, for the people. That's where the people are, the young people especially. So, get over there.
Amena Brown:
Oh, I love that. Well, y'all remember these things. But even if you don't remember, you can go to the show notes. All the links to where you can get Homecoming, where you can connect with Dr. Thema, we'll make sure all the links were there. Dr. Thema, this has been such a pleasure to talk with you, thank you for taking the time. And thank you for giving the people something that can help us along our healing journeys, thank you for putting that work out into the world.
Dr. Thema Bryant:
Oh, you are welcome. It's been delightful talking to you, and I'm just grateful for this space. Many blessings for you and for your listeners.
Amena Brown:
HER With Amena Brown is produced by Matt Owen for Sol Graffiti Productions, as a part of the Seneca Women Podcast Network, in partnership with iHeart Radio. Thanks for listening, and don't forget to subscribe, rate, and review the podcast.